5150 build.

Andy Eagle said:
That is a 40 "E" but the rest is just a 9 set and it's not tuned down a half step.
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I just thought of a question and you seem to be the one to ask. As you know, rumors about Eddie are all over the place.

Question is, I saw a video of a song tutorial and the guy said Eddie slightly down tuned either his B or G string because he didn't think those two sounded good together tuned normally, is this really a thing he did or just another urban legend? Lol 🤣

Just to be clear, I may be backwards one way or the other. Maybe it was the G and was tuned up a little, but still something to do with the tuning of this two strings.

Thanks in advance. I have never heard anyone as knowledgeable as you in so many things "Ed", and when I saw the strings question, that popped back into my mind.
 
Mike Evans said:
I just thought of a question and you seem to be the one to ask. As you know, rumors about Eddie are all over the place.

Question is, I saw a video of a song tutorial and the guy said Eddie slightly down tuned either his B or G string because he didn't think those two sounded good together tuned normally, is this really a thing he did or just another urban legend? Lol 🤣

Just to be clear, I may be backwards one way or the other. Maybe it was the G and was tuned up a little, but still something to do with the tuning of this two strings.

Thanks in advance. I have never heard anyone as knowledgeable as you in so many things "Ed", and when I saw the strings question, that popped back into my mind.
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In the early recordings Ed tuned to what sounded right to him with the chords in the rhythm . Live? not.
 
Budda said:
The dedication is quite impressive. As are the skills and pics.
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I am in total awe of his skills, knowledge, dedication, etc. This has been an awesome thread to follow. I was actually getting fidgety the last few weeks with no updates. Lol 😂
 
I know the 5150 is a Pacer Special body. Do you know if the tone and mini switch holes had to be filled or were the controls drilled at the Kramer facility?

On the subject of the wood, poplar can have some ugly green tinting in it. Basswood tends to be pretty plain and even coloring. It seems you could get a good idea on the back where the paint is missing. The first time I started hearing about basswood was the late 80’s when the Ibanez Jems and RG’s started coming out. It didn’t seem to be a very common wood in guitars in the early 80’s. Doesn’t seem likely Kramer would have a basswood body laying around unless Ed told them he wanted one in advance so they could order it.
 
Mike Evans said:
This was basically, (exactly?) what the guy said. I did do what he said, and it did sound nicer. At least that particular song.
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It is actually pretty common to tune to the part or to the song when recording. For example: if you tune a guitar so your first position A chord is perfecty in tune, playing a D will be a mess :)
 
darkknight91 said:
I know the 5150 is a Pacer Special body. Do you know if the tone and mini switch holes had to be filled or were the controls drilled at the Kramer facility?

On the subject of the wood, poplar can have some ugly green tinting in it. Basswood tends to be pretty plain and even coloring. It seems you could get a good idea on the back where the paint is missing. The first time I started hearing about basswood was the late 80’s when the Ibanez Jems and RG’s started coming out. It didn’t seem to be a very common wood in guitars in the early 80’s. Doesn’t seem likely Kramer would have a basswood body laying around unless Ed told them he wanted one in advance so they could order it.
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Poplar doesn't always in every plank have the green streaks and yes this is a good identification method . Basswood also sometimes has very similar grain. The holes and sometimes the pickup routs were done at Kramer to allow flexibility. The question of how did a non stock wood pacer end up at Kramer has a few answers. The first is Kramer had just stopped using maple for the body and requested a lighter (but also cheap) alternative. They may have sent samples in different light woods. I have seen a half poplar half alder pacer but your right the stock was poplar. 5150 is a very light body, under 3 1/2 lb body unloaded and it is only partially finish sanded . An explanation for swamp ash is the same; an unfinished sample laying around until someone picked it up and finding it to be very light decided to use it for Ed. No special order Sports bodies are known.
The grain on the back, and all the visible grain;
IMG_2420.JPG
IMG_2374.JPGIMG_2419.JPG
These are the best shots. Its very worn and dirty but it has the properties of a technical softwood (again ruling out swamp ash.) but dirty worn basswood or dirty worn poplar? Both can look like this easily .
 
Now the bits that do look like swamp ash;
IMG_2375.JPG
Those visible grain marks in the wear patch next to the pickup look like ash. But could be ingrained dirt from all the use.
and the obvious one;275622271_154471370281419_5062625209410026207_n.jpg
Ive seen unprimed soft woods swell with soaked in paint but those open pours look like ash.
If you paint ash like this with no prep the grain will be clearly visible all over and on 5150 it isn't.
 
I made this modern version of the Eddie classic a few years ago. Nowhere near as detailed as yours, but I thought I would share it… the Seymour Duncans re-issue of the humbucker they did for Eddie, basswood body (one of Eddie’s early guitars was a Charvel basswood body), maple neck, locking tuners, Goto 510 bridge. Again, it wasn’t (nor was it intended to be) any original spec, but it was what I wanted based on my peculiarities. I gave it to a friend who appreciates Eddie‘s work as much as I do before I moved out of the country.

Great work on your guitar, by the way!!! I know that great appreciation for an instrument that you put together yourself.
 

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Andy Eagle said:
I had only intended to build one but then it got complicated.
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Classic mission creep, but sometimes it's just so fun to go down the rabbit hole. Either way it's been a blast following the thread and now I'm tempted to swap out the pup in my single H Strat from a SD Pearly Gates to a SD CCJ
 
Thanks for the pictures, Andy. I saw someone make a case for basswood a couple years ago. They cut a body and the forearm cut had the same open grain pattern as Ed’s. Don’t remember who or where I seen it. Could have been at VHND but I’m not sure. I was very surprised that basswood could do that. I was convinced that it was basswood but following your investigation it’s hard to say without seeing the guitar in person. The back doesn’t look like ash. The face doesn’t look like ash. Only that forearm cut and that little spot by the pickup you pointed out but as I said before, I’ve seen examples that basswood can do that. Also inside the cutaways there would be a lot of open grain if it was ash and hadn’t been filled. I’m leaning towards basswood but for the times it wasn’t a very common wood. However. it was used as you pointed out Holdsworth.
 
darkknight91 said:
Thanks for the pictures, Andy. I saw someone make a case for basswood a couple years ago. They cut a body and the forearm cut had the same open grain pattern as Ed’s. Don’t remember who or where I seen it. Could have been at VHND but I’m not sure. I was very surprised that basswood could do that. I was convinced that it was basswood but following your investigation it’s hard to say without seeing the guitar in person. The back doesn’t look like ash. The face doesn’t look like ash. Only that forearm cut and that little spot by the pickup you pointed out but as I said before, I’ve seen examples that basswood can do that. Also inside the cutaways there would be a lot of open grain if it was ash and hadn’t been filled. I’m leaning towards basswood but for the times it wasn’t a very common wood. However. it was used as you pointed out Holdsworth.
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The other points for basswood are:
Scott (musikraft) says it is.
The fact that when music man made the prototypes for Ed to replicate the tone of 5150 ALL of them were basswood and they had 5150 to work from.
Every guitar after made for Ed is basswood .
All the backup Kramer guitars from 5150 on are basswood (I have disassembled some.)
The ripped out screws hooks, failed post holes and crushed neck plate are all typical for basswood.
 
unix-guy said:
Was that only a rumor? There used to be an official 5150 string set (Ernie Ball, I think) that were 9-40. I used them for a while because I preferred the 40 low E and the 15 G string.
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Early on, Ed used Fender 150 .009 strings that were 9-40. I used the same ones, too. That’s why those early 5150 strings were the same gauge.

Andy Eagle said:
The other points for basswood are:
Scott (musikraft) says it is.
The fact that when music man made the prototypes for Ed to replicate the tone of 5150 ALL of them were basswood and they had 5150 to work from.
Every guitar after made for Ed is basswood .
All the backup Kramer guitars from 5150 on are basswood (I have disassembled some.)
The ripped out screws hooks, failed post holes and crushed neck plate are all typical for basswood.
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Wasn’t the original EB prototype that Ed used to finish the F.U.C.K. album a solid unfinished basswood without the maple top? I seem to remember that from an interview. Your point makes sense. Your work is top notch, btw. Thanks for sharing your journey of this.
 
unix-guy said:
Was that only a rumor?
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I read in one spot online that it was a rumor, probably TGP or some place like that, where anything goes for truth. But my EVH knowledge is virtually nothing; it’s just that when I look up general tone it guitar questions I inevitably find EVH rabbit holes, and they’re all fascinating, so I get sucked in. Hell, I only started listening to Van Halen a few years ago; the band was so ubiquitous when I was growing up it weirdly made me want to ignore them. It’s only recently I realized what I missing, to my own detriment!
 
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