A Difference between 16.05 ...And 17.02 .... An Explanation ???

fafakiwi

Experienced
Hi All ,
I ve stayed quite a long time on 16.05 , waited for 17.02 and all its new features , but i ve found something strange on a preset that i use a lot , for noodling , playing , enjoying , i ve attached it ....
I ve found that this preset is far more overdriven in 17.02 than in 16.05 , i was totally surprised when i ve heard the first notes in 17.02....
So i ve tried myself to search where were the differences , the reason of these modifications in the sound of this preset as Cliff mentionned that there were no modifications in amp modelling .
So i ve rolled back to 16.05 , made some screen captures on my mac of the compressor , amp block ... check everything possible ....i suppose
i ve recorded a sample before moving again to 17.02 and do the same thing .....
So here are the preset and the two samples from 16.05 and 17.02 ..... But i did not found why my preset sound so different , a lot more overdriven in 17.02...
I d like to understand if anyone has an explanation .... i ll appreciate !!!!
Cheeeeerss
Fafa

 

Attachments

  • wickedgame2(1).syx
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I can’t be of much help regarding the change in gain, but I do want to say that the first one sounds amazing. I don’t give out compliments often, but I really enjoyed listening to your playing and tonality on the first clip. What guitar are you using there?
 
Both sound nice, but the newer one is definitely more overdriven than the older version. Likely a simple tweak to get it right, but I understand you’re looking for a why more than a how. It’ll help having the original recorded to get it matched up.
 
I can’t be of much help regarding the change in gain, but I do want to say that the first one sounds amazing. I don’t give out compliments often, but I really enjoyed listening to your playing and tonality on the first clip. What guitar are you using there?
thanks , but i was only .... noodling , just playing something to record .... ;)
:)
i ve used an ES-335
 
Both sound nice, but the newer one is definitely more overdriven than the older version. Likely a simple tweak to get it right, but I understand you’re looking for a why more than a how. It’ll help having the original recorded to get it matched up.
Yesss , that drives me a little bit crazy that i ve found no changes in the different blocks after having checking them ....
i can reduce gain in the amp block , but Amp modelling has not changed ...so i should not need do to that ......
 
.....And if it happens on one preset , it can be the same for all .... not a good idea ,
maybe Cliff if he might take a look at this thread could have hints on the reason of those differences ...
 
Disengaging the comp clears a lot of that up. Maybe it’s in the compressor?
some comp have changed , the thresold has dissapeared from certain but not this one , so ... it s the same block both in 16.05 and in 17.02...
i don t think it comes from this block ... but .... ;)
 
Yesss , that drives me a little bit crazy that i ve found no changes in the different blocks after having checking them ....
i can reduce gain in the amp block , but Amp modelling has not changed ...so i should not need do to that ......
I've definitely noticed the 'change' but it was from 17.01 to 17.02 for me. Don't get me wrong, I know there hasn't been a change to the modelling from Cliff & Team. But there is a change in my presets' sound that I would describe exactly as you have and demonstrated. It's like a little 'left over' gain/distortion/hair/grit that is just there. The prior tone had some compression that translated to 'feel'. Where this tone is has lost that feel and replaced it with leftover grit. I don't know how else to describe it and it could be that it's unique to both of us. One thing I could do is go back to 17.01, listen and then come back to 17.02, just as a trouble shooting exercise.

And I'm not trying to complain because I can dial it out. I'm only saying that I've noticed this. High Class problem for sure. FWIW I'm not using a compressor block that's active in the chain and it's there in the 3 presets I play with. I'll reply back if I find that the issue goes away after going back to 17.01 and install update again to 17.02. It's definitely not something I'd ask the Fractal team to spend time chasing down.
 
It's still there. Something happened that was odd to me though. I'd set up a preset in 17.01 and I guess I'd tweaked it after 17.02 was installed. The preset was not there when I re-installed 17.01. The name appeared but there were no blocks in the definition. When I re-installed 17.02 the preset was there again and working. So, I'm left with the questions: If any 'changes' are made to a preset while a later firmware version is installed is the preset not available to previous firmware versions? Or is it when any changes are made to a specific parameter that was changed in the firmware? In this case, I'd made some changes to the CAB blocks to high-cut and I'd toyed with the speaker compression parameters in the amp block.

Not really all that important questions... just trying to understand.
 
It's still there. Something happened that was odd to me though. I'd set up a preset in 17.01 and I guess I'd tweaked it after 17.02 was installed. The preset was not there when I re-installed 17.01. The name appeared but there were no blocks in the definition. When I re-installed 17.02 the preset was there again and working. So, I'm left with the questions: If any 'changes' are made to a preset while a later firmware version is installed is the preset not available to previous firmware versions? Or is it when any changes are made to a specific parameter that was changed in the firmware? In this case, I'd made some changes to the CAB blocks to high-cut and I'd toyed with the speaker compression parameters in the amp block.

Not really all that important questions... just trying to understand.
If you saved it while on 17.02, It is now officially a 17.02 preset. With all of it's unique possibilities. It can no longer be loaded it on any firmware that it older, as there will be things that potentially do not exist in the older firmware. The preset is still there, but it will just show as a blank grid.
 
Hi my Axemaster , you have no idea for such a different in sound ..?? I ve Check mostly all parameters of thé blocks … they are thé same but thé sound is different … really strange …
 
If you saved it while on 17.02, It is now officially a 17.02 preset. With all of it's unique possibilities. It can no longer be loaded it on any firmware that it older, as there will be things that potentially do not exist in the older firmware. The preset is still there, but it will just show as a blank griid

Hi my Axemaster , you have no idea for such a different in sound ..?? I ve Check mostly all parameters of thé blocks … they are thé same but thé sound is different … really strange
 
If you saved it while on 17.02, It is now officially a 17.02 preset. With all of it's unique possibilities. It can no longer be loaded it on any firmware that it older, as there will be things that potentially do not exist in the older firmware. The preset is still there, but it will just show as a blank grid.
Thanks for the explanation, Moke.
 
Hi my Axemaster , you have no idea for such a different in sound ..?? I ve Check mostly all parameters of thé blocks … they are thé same but thé sound is different … really strange

I know you're question is for @Moke but the way I tackled the issue was cutting more highs. I used a PEQ block in one preset and cut them in the cab on another. It helped dial out some of the sizzle and got me closer to where I was previously.
 
I know you're question is for @Moke but the way I tackled the issue was cutting more highs. I used a PEQ block in one preset and cut them in the cab on another. It helped dial out some of the sizzle and got me closer to where I was previously.
Thanks , i appréciate … but i would surely appréciate why …. Thé reason of such differences
 
some comp have changed , the thresold has dissapeared from certain but not this one , so ... it s the same block both in 16.05 and in 17.02...
i don t think it comes from this block ... but .... ;)
+1 on this. If the compressor change ended up resulting in a hotter output, that would hit your amp harder and cause higher gain.

My thoughts:
1. Try without compressor in 16.05 and 17.02 and see if there is still a difference.
2. Try re-dialing in the compressor if it was one of the ones that changed.
 
No offense but my favorite update was 16.05 - thought it was awesome and made a backup of it might go back to it - 16.05 recording above just seems less dirty to me and pleasing - thanks for sharing
 
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