Axe-Fx III Firmware Release Version 16.01 Beta 1 Public Beta

[boyce89976]

I've been confused about something, and I think there may be others who are too. When updating FW, what actions are required to get the benefit of the FW on current presets? Some mentions of "updates upon preset recall" or "resetting amp block" are two different things, resetting requiring the user to re-dial in amp settings/start from scratch.

I'm on the new beta, and did an amp block reset on my main preset, and I think I'm getting the benefit of the new beta, but honestly, I'm not sure if a reset was even required.

 

[electronpirate]

I've been confused about something, and I think there may be others who are too. When updating FW, what actions are required to get the benefit of the FW on current presets? Some mentions of "updates upon preset recall" or "resetting amp block" are two different things, resetting requiring the user to re-dial in amp settings/start from scratch.

I'm on the new beta, and did an amp block reset on my main preset, and I think I'm getting the benefit of the new beta, but honestly, I'm not sure if a reset was even required.

Try an amp block reset. With all these things...use your ears. Not beneficial to get all caught up in what others think, so yes, you might have to redial in things, but it will always be better. A common fault is 'I update my presets, and they should sound better out of the box.' Maybe that will be true on some amps, but again...your ears need to be your guide.

 

[Forever Again]

I've been confused about something, and I think there may be others who are too. When updating FW, what actions are required to get the benefit of the FW on current presets? Some mentions of "updates upon preset recall" or "resetting amp block" are two different things, resetting requiring the user to re-dial in amp settings/start from scratch.

I'm on the new beta, and did an amp block reset on my main preset, and I think I'm getting the benefit of the new beta, but honestly, I'm not sure if a reset was even required.

Good question, I’m sure some will say if it sounds good to you then leave it be, otherwise try x, y, z. I think it just depends how much you tweaked the amp block outside the Authentic tab. I was on (am on) version 12. I plan to recreate my presets from scratch. Maybe I could just delete the amp block and re-add/dial it in, keeping all my effects in place. I figure it’s a little work, but hey, that’s the road we’re on and it’s totally worth it. If I remember correctly you run a pedalboard in front so your presets may not be that in depth as others. I may be wrong though (probably am ). Try setting up another preset the same from scratch and A/B them.

 

[boyce89976]

Try an amp block reset. With all these things...use your ears. Not beneficial to get all caught up in what others think, so yes, you might have to redial in things, but it will always be better. A common fault is 'I update my presets, and they should sound better out of the box.' Maybe that will be true on some amps, but again...your ears need to be your guide.

Thanks! I'm not really worried what others think, I'm simply confused about what's required to get updates "into" existing presets.

 

[boyce89976]

Good question, I’m sure some will say if it sounds good to you then leave it be, otherwise try x, y, z. I think it just depends how much you tweaked the amp block outside the Authentic tab. I was on (am on) version 12. I plan to recreate my presets from scratch. Maybe I could just delete the amp block and re-add/dial it in, keeping all my effects in place. I figure it’s a little work, but hey, that’s the road we’re on and it’s totally worth it. If I remember correctly you run a pedalboard in front so your presets may not be that in depth as others. I may be wrong though (probably am ). Try setting up another preset the same from scratch and A/B them.

You're right, I do run a pedalboard in front! So yeah, my presets are simple compared to most. I'm more curious about the process required to get the FW updates "into" the existing preset... like which step is fool-proof, if that makes sense. I do these updates, but I'm never quite sure what needs to be done to impact existing presets, haha!

 

[electronpirate]

Thanks! I'm not really worried what others think, I'm simply confused about what's required to get updates "into" existing presets.

Your guide is the release notes. Do an amp reset, and try your presets.

 

[State of Epicicity]

I'm loving the latest release, having dialed in presets for the Dirty Shirley and Brit 800 Mod that are some of the best tones I've ever had.

I do have a couple of questions about some weirdness, and I'm not sure if it has to do with this release in particular, but I'm posting here in case it might:

A low note that I'm not actually playing sometimes appears with three particular amps that I've tried so far in the latest release:

Class-A 30W Hot
Deluxe Tweed
Citrus A30 Dirty

Here are examples:










It's similar to what's initially described in this thread (although this occurrence is not creating octaves). I'm curious if this could totally be just a natural part of how their real world counterparts behave, and if so, if there are any ways to dial out that behavior with the advanced parameters in the amp block. Tube amps can behave really strangely inherently, and I've never played a real AC30, Tweed Deluxe, or AD30, so what the hell do I know? For the AD30 it only happens when the MV is set high, but for the AC30 Hot and Deluxe Tweed, it even happens with the default settings when resetting the block channel.

I've uploaded a preset (named in strict accordance with Schoolhouse Rock nomenclature) containing the three amps, as well as a raw audio file of me playing that really illustrates the wierdness. I have refreshed AxeEdit after installing 16.01 Beta 1, and for each scene I've reset the amp block and paired the amp with a matching factory cabinet. On the recording I'm playing on a set of Duncan Saturday Night Specials in the neck position with volume and tone on 10 on a set neck superstrat. Yes, I'm playing the theme to Last of the Mohicans.

There could totally be something else going on to cause this, and I thank you in advance for any insight and / or guidance.

 

[Triaxis75]

How the unit processes the signal is what seems to be the basis of this FW. The extras like grid bias this or that being corrected/different is more of an accuracy issue for what's true to the authentic sound. I don't like several amps in their natural state, which is why I keep some old presets...not because I feel it's inaccurate but because of my personal preference of what's good and what's poo-poo. But, for purposes of what's needed to gain the value of the FW.. update to the recent firmware. It process the sound in it's respective manner regardless of settings. Got to look at it from Signal Processing vs. Settings options perspective. If you updated the FW, you are getting the benefit of the algorithms in place. How the settings perform and the characteristics that are affected, since updating, may be the answer to the question you're asking. If I totally missed the point of what you're asking or am repeating common knowledge, disregard...didn't mean to create a negative or redundant contribution.

 

[boyce89976]

How the unit processes the signal is what seems to be the basis of this FW. The extras like grid bias this or that being corrected/different is more of an accuracy issue for what's true to the authentic sound. I don't like several amps in their natural state, which is why I keep some old presets...not because I feel it's inaccurate but because of my personal preference of what's good and what's poo-poo. But, for purposes of what's needed to gain the value of the FW.. update to the recent firmware. It process the sound in it's respective manner regardless of settings. Got to look at it from Signal Processing vs. Settings perspective. If you updated the FW, you are getting the benefit of the algorithms in place. How the settings perform and the characteristics that are affected, since updating, may be the answer to the question you're asking. If I totally missed the point of what you're asking or am repeating common knowledge, disregard...didn't mean to create a negative or redundant contribution.

This is partly what I'm looking for, and very helpful. So, if I understand you correctly, the FW update takes care of the processing benefit. So the remaining question is from a settings perspective what needs to be done to update to new defaults? In the beta, it's stated that a "existing presets will update the aforementioned parameters to the new default values upon recall." Prior updates mentioned resetting the amp block, and some updates haven't mentioned any process to get the new default settings.

There may not be any single process, to update to the new FW default settings, and it's FW specific. Just trying to make sense of it for my tiny brain, haha!

 

[State of Epicicity]

How the unit processes the signal is what seems to be the basis of this FW. The extras like grid bias this or that being corrected/different is more of an accuracy issue for what's true to the authentic sound. I don't like several amps in their natural state, which is why I keep some old presets...not because I feel it's inaccurate but because of my personal preference of what's good and what's poo-poo. But, for purposes of what's needed to gain the value of the FW.. update to the recent firmware. It process the sound in it's respective manner regardless of settings. Got to look at it from Signal Processing vs. Settings options perspective. If you updated the FW, you are getting the benefit of the algorithms in place. How the settings perform and the characteristics that are affected, since updating, may be the answer to the question you're asking. If I totally missed the point of what you're asking or am repeating common knowledge, disregard...didn't mean to create a negative or redundant contribution.

Thanks for your thoughts on this. I'm not sure how to put my question any differently, but just to pull it out of my long post: "I'm curious if this could totally be just a natural part of how their real world counterparts behave, and if so, if there are any ways to dial out that behavior with the advanced parameters in the amp block." I'm asking in this beta thread because a couple of coding errors have been found by Cliff as Cygnus was being developed, with the 5153 Red Channel, Friedmans, and others; in case this could possibly maybe be something wrong. I have no reference point for this with an AC30, Tweed Deluxe, or AD30, so I thought someone who knows these amps really well, or maybe even Cliff, may be able to jump in tell me if that's just how those amps are, and / or if there's some sort of deep tweak that can change that behavior on virtually any amp that acts that way. Not a big deal, but I am curious. I'm not at all an amp guru, so I wouldn't know off the top of my head what aspects of the preamp or poweramp contribute to this kind of phenomenon.

Edit: Sorry, I think you were writing in response to @boyce89976, not to me!

 

[Triaxis75]

This is partly what I'm looking for, and very helpful. So, if I understand you correctly, the FW update takes care of the processing benefit. So the remaining question is from a settings perspective what needs to be done to update to new defaults? In the beta, it's stated that a "existing presets will update the aforementioned parameters to the new default values upon recall." Prior updates mentioned resetting the amp block, and some updates haven't mentioned any process to get the new default settings.

There may not be any single process, to update to the new FW default settings, and it's FW specific. Just trying to make sense of it for my tiny brain, haha!

Resetting the amp will align all the spec corrections to what is accurate to the amp from the team's testing. So essentially, your starting point will be from a more accurate position. Now before resetting, accurate may not equate to a preferable sound. I've never owned a Diezel but I've heard ups and downs on it. I have no perspective on it, only their views on what it should or shouldn't be. If I pull it up to mess with it, I try to make it sound how I want it sound. From previous history, I'll tweak what I think it needs in tweaks but with accuracy in characteristics of how the amp should sound will differ than how it did before. Not because it's incorrect, but because it's different than how i previously learned it. This is why I start from a fresh palate. Having to do forensics on every knob to get that one frequency to buzz right will kill 4 horses and a cow if I try to do it backwards.

 

[Triaxis75]

Thanks for your thoughts on this. I'm not sure how to put my question any differently, but just to pull it out of my long post: "I'm curious if this could totally be just a natural part of how their real world counterparts behave, and if so, if there are any ways to dial out that behavior with the advanced parameters in the amp block." I'm asking in this beta thread because a couple of coding errors have been found by Cliff as Cygnus was being developed, with the 5153 Red Channel, Friedmans, and others; in case this could possibly maybe be something wrong. I have no reference point for this with an AC30, Tweed Deluxe, or AD30, so I thought someone who knows these amps really well, or maybe even Cliff, may be able to jump in tell me if that's just how those amps are, and / or if there's some sort of deep tweak that can change that behavior on virtually any amp that acts that way. Not a big deal, but I am curious. I'm not at all an amp guru, so I wouldn't know off the top of my head what aspects of the preamp or poweramp contribute to this kind of phenomenon.

Honestly I'm in the same boat, I have no point of reference with most...just never had that much money to find out when i was younger LoL. I try to treat each amp as it's own separate entity and see how it sounds with the knobs turned. Give it a fair chance to succeed or fail on it's own. Not because it's wrong but because it's not what im looking for at that moment. But back to the accuracy issues, I can only assume what other's post are accurate and intelligent depictions. In the meantime, I'll have fun with what it's interpretation is.

 

[Andy G]

I'm loving the latest release, having dialed in presets for the Dirty Shirley and Brit 800 Mod that are some of the best tones I've ever had.

I do have a couple of questions about some weirdness, and I'm not sure if it has to do with this release in particular, but I'm posting here in case it might:

A low note that I'm not actually playing sometimes appears with three particular amps that I've tried so far in the latest release:

Class-A 30W Hot
Deluxe Tweed
Citrus A30 Dirty

Here are examples:










It's similar to what's initially described in this thread (although this occurrence is not creating octaves). I'm curious if this could totally be just a natural part of how their real world counterparts behave, and if so, if there are any ways to dial out that behavior with the advanced parameters in the amp block. Tube amps can behave really strangely inherently, and I've never played a real AC30, Tweed Deluxe, or AD30, so what the hell do I know? For the AD30 it only happens when the MV is set high, but for the AC30 Hot and Deluxe Tweed, it even happens with the default settings when resetting the block channel.

I've uploaded a preset (named in strict accordance with Schoolhouse Rock nomenclature) containing the three amps, as well as a raw audio file of me playing that really illustrates the wierdness. I have refreshed AxeEdit after installing 16.01 Beta 1, and for each scene I've reset the amp block and paired the amp with a matching factory cabinet. On the recording I'm playing on a set of Duncan Saturday Night Specials in the neck position with volume and tone on 10 on a set neck superstrat. Yes, I'm playing the theme to Last of the Mohicans.

There could totally be something else going on to cause this, and I thank you in advance for any insight and / or guidance.

It sounds like ghost notes. Increase the B+ Time Constant in the amp Power Supply tab. You can make them really prominent by turning the B+ Time Constant down low, if that's your thing (I suspect it isn't).

https://forum.fractalaudio.com/threads/ghost-notes.126903/

 

[State of Epicicity]

It sounds like ghost notes. Increase the B+ Time Constant in the amp Power Supply tab. You can make them really prominent by turning the B+ Time Constant down low, if that's your thing (I suspect it isn't).

https://forum.fractalaudio.com/threads/ghost-notes.126903/

Complete awesomeness. Thank you so much for that answer; of course it worked instantly. And reading Cliff's description is so helpful. It looks like I didn't have the right term to describe what I was hearing. It's funny, I wanted to write "ghost notes," but all I could think of with that term was the phenomenon of a note on the fretboard that dies quickly, usually due to the resonance with the truss rod. Now I know it does properly apply to this context too.

Much appreciated!

I'm guessing then that ghost notes are probably very much a real world problem for these amps in that case.

 

[Andy G]

Complete awesomeness. Thank you so much for that answer; of course it worked instantly. And reading Cliff's description is so helpful. It looks like I didn't have the right term to describe what I was hearing. It's funny, I wanted to write "ghost notes," but all I could think of with that term was the phenomenon of a note on the fretboard that dies quickly, usually due to the resonance with the truss rod. Now I know it does properly apply to this context too.

Much appreciated!

I'm guessing then that ghost notes are probably very much a real world problem for these amps in that case.

No worries at all, glad it helped!

And yes, definitely a real world problem. We get the amps in their raw glory, warts and all.

 

[Greg Ferguson]

next time you update, make sure you reset the amp channel you're using. copy it over to one of the other channels before you reset, so you can keep a record of any deep tweaks you made and also compare the reset version against the non-reset version. resetting the channel makes sure that all the paramters are at their default values for the new firmware version

I started using the Snapshot prior to resetting the amp block, and then immediately after. That way the first snapshot is pre and the second is post reset, so I can bounce back and forth and look at what changed. It's similar to using another channel, but doesn't take up a channel and can have a lot more adjustments saved.

 

[OldSnail]

I thought the same too when I first tried it on Cygnus, since it's quite different than the old Ares model, but then I watched this video and it sounds pretty much identical to the new model for me

Personally, I find this VH4 sounding bad.
And sure, it does not sound like the VH4 I played.

 

[Sashman]

Here's a little clip comparison that hopefully illustrates my tip. The higher Input Trim gives palm mutes a little more hair and thickness behind them while the default Input Trim keeps them a little tidier and controlled.

1. Real amp
2. Model with Input Trim at 1.00
3. Input Trim raised
4. Real amp
5. Switches between models with raised Input Trim and default Input Trim.

Holy Moly!
Would you like to share the preset?
Which IR did you use?
Thanks
Sash

 

[OldSnail]

I've just tested the VH4 ch.3 and 4 in FW 16.01.
As I remember my own VH4, I think that ch.4 is ok.
To suit my rememberings, for ch.3 I have to set input trim on +3.8.

 

[milan.pohancenik]

Personally, I find this VH4 sounding bad.
And sure, it does not sound like the VH4 I played.

It does sound bad, quite aggressive, but that's the mic position. The loose bottom end is always in every video I watch about the Diezel VH4. Even he mentioned it, that it's tight, but it's only his "in the room" impression again, not the mic'd sound.