Overwhelmed by Cabs

Dr. Dipwad

Experienced
Hi, my name is Dr. Dipwad, and I am Overwhelmed by Cabs.

(The scene: A circle of folding chairs in a church basement. The assembled 12-step "Cab-Overwhelmed" group responds, "Hi, Dr. Dipwad...," and a white-coated facilitator nods affirmingly to continue....) ;)

I suspect I'm not alone, because there's a WISH in the wish-list forum asking for Folders/Directories to manage cabs. And Rex had the following to say:
+1. User cabs are a brilliant feature, but managing them is cumbersome at best. That’s the main reason I prefer to use factory cabs in the absence of a compelling reason not to.
Yeah. I'm with ya', Rex. That's what I did through the entire Axe FX II era.

I never used a User Cab live, not even once.

I tried exploring around in them at one point. There were a few I liked, even. But I wasn't taking notes at the time, just casually scrolling and noodling.

So when it came time to set up sounds for a live gig, did any non-standard Cabs I'd liked get used? Nope, because it was a week later and I had no idea which ones they were.

And now, in the Axe III era, I have the ability to blend multiple IRs in a single Cab Block! 4 of them! My options just went up exponentially and instead of feeling empowered I kinda feel bewildered.

It's a bit like being one of the proverbial Russian defectors from the Soviet era who stood in an American supermarket for the first time and had a panic attack because they couldn't cope with having so many options. (Slight exaggeration.)

SO, HERE'S MY QUESTION:

You people who aren't overwhelmed by Cabs, how do you do it?

I'm not talking about people who "opt out" of the whole question by picking 5 cabs that sound good enough and sticking with them.

I mean: Let's say there's a tone you want to achieve, and you have 1,000 Cabs, a hundred of which will come close, but out of which there'll be one that's best.

What's your workflow?

Do you sit there with pencil and notepad and scroll through all 1,000 rating them good or bad? And then...I dunno, do a runoff of the "good ones" to get it down to the top 10? Or what?
 
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It's a bit like being one of the proverbial Russian defectors from the Soviet era who stood in an American supermarket for the first time and had a panic attack because they couldn't cope with having so many options. (Slight exaggeration.)

Yeah I've been there. It was painstaking at first but I put the looper in my chain and recorded a riff that covered a lot of bases and closed my eyes and began scrolling. When I found something that sounded close to appealing, I opened my eyes and wrote down what IR it was. Went through all the factory cabs, as well as cab pack 7 (shows how long its been). I kind of fall into both categories, as I now have a list of all the cabs I like based on what sound I'm going after, but I don't have to scroll through hundreds to get me where I'm going.

I think of it like a game of darts, I try to hit the board first, then work on the bulls eye.

I'm much better at dialing in my tones than darts btw...:tearsofjoy:
 
I am overwhelmed by Cabs.

I suspect I'm not alone, because there's a WISH in the wish-list forum asking for Folders/Directories to manage cabs. And Rex had the following to say:

Yeah, with ya', Rex. That's what I did through the entire Axe FX II era.

I never used a User Cab live, not even once.

I tried exploring around in them at one point. There were a few I liked, even. But I wasn't taking notes at the time, just casually scrolling and noodling.

So when it came time to set up sounds for a live gig, did any non-standard Cabs I'd liked get used? Nope, because it was a week later and I had no idea which ones they were.

And now, in the Axe III era, I have the ability to blend multiple IRs in a single Cab Block! 4 of them! My options just went up exponentially and instead of feeling empowered I kinda feel bewildered.

It's a bit like being one of the proverbial Russian defectors from the Soviet era who stood in an American supermarket for the first time and had a panic attack because they couldn't cope with having so many options. (Slight exaggeration.)

SO, HERE'S MY QUESTION:

You people who aren't overwhelmed by Cabs, how do you do it?

I'm not talking about people who "opt out" of the whole question by picking 5 cabs that sound good enough and sticking with them.

I mean: Let's say there's a tone you want to achieve, and you have 1,000 Cabs, a hundred of which will come close, but out of which there'll be one that's best.

What's your workflow?

Do you sit there with pencil and notepad and scroll through all 1,000 rating them good or bad? And then...I dunno, do a runoff of the "good ones" to get it down to the top 10? Or what?
Not sure how much this helps you, but I generally stick with a few options for IRs that I use with all my modelers (Fractal, Helix, Atomic, etc). These are Ownhammer 412 MAR CB. I like these IRs and they work for me with all modellers. Although I may choose different IRs within the pack based on which modeler I am using.
 
When I first acquired the Axe-Fx Ultra, I knew little about cabs and speakers. Previously I just got the hardware cabinet that the manufacturer offered for the amp I had.

I learnt as I went along. About different kinds of speakers, about mics, mic positions etc. And by trying of course.

You can’t expect to be able to choose wisely, if you don’t have the required knowledge. As demonstrated in Monty Python’s Holy Grail.

I learnt that I prefer G12M and G12H speakers, and the simplicity of a single balanced mic, like the Beyer M160.

Meanwhile, the wiki contains a wealth of info about speakers and mics:


Speakers that pair well with a certain amp (model) are listed in the wiki’s Amplifier Models List, and my PDF Amp Guide. Look up that speaker in the Cabinet Models List to see which factory cabs in the II and AX8, or which “Legacy” cab in the III corresponds with it.

The list of stock cabs in the III is so long that I probably won’t make an equivalent list for the new stock cabs in the III soon.

By the way, I use a single IR in my presets. Is it the perfect one? Probably not. Will there be “better” one out there? For sure. But I like this one enough.
 
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How I do it:
I have a real Zilla Fatboy. So, for my metal band, I use exclusively Zilla fatboy IR's. Thinking, i should capture my own IR sometime.

My Rock band uses the Orange Rockwerb amp sim. The Orange cab fits best with it. There aren't that many orange IR's in the axe...

Having too many choices kinda sucks, so it's a good idea to frame yourself in somehow.
 
Not sure how much this helps you, but I generally stick with a few options for IRs that I use with all my modelers (Fractal, Helix, Atomic, etc). These are Ownhammer 412 MAR CB. I like these IRs and they work for me with all modellers. Although I may choose different IRs within the pack based on which modeler I am using.

It's funny, but out of the myriad of cabinets choices I too have only a couple of goto favorites. However, I do love having all the excess of options, but I guess once you find what fits your needs you tend to stick with it.

Yes, it can be a bit overwhelming, but it's a lot of fun hearing different options. No complaints here. =:·)

...and I do perform with them live on most occasions.
 
I initially approach it the same way I would with real cabs. I know I like v30’s for certain heavier sounds and greenbacks for others. I also like the g12h v30 combo. I focus on those first and then demo the IR’s by looping a short riff or by looping a clip via Logic.
 
The best thing I did was make blocks and renamed and saved them as blk files. Now I have a compact section of my fav cab or cabs that I can quickly use to test on different amps.

Yes this is after much experimentation with various factory and non fact irs
 
The best thing I did was make blocks and renamed and saved them as blk files. Now I have a compact section of my fav cab or cabs that I can quickly use to test on different amps.

Yes this is after much experimentation with various factory and non fact irs
But this can't be done on the Axe3 yet right?
 
Imagine you just walked into a music store that has 2000 cabs stacked against the wall. You try a dozen of them that look good to you and take home the one whose sound you like the best, secure in the knowledge that there will be many opportunities to revisit the store and try out a dozen more.
 
Lots of mindful trial and error, after years of trying and moving on I started to notice I only really care for a handful of mics (an sm57 being my go to but not being opposed to the royer 121), I also tend to gravitate towards a certain handful of speakers (greenbacks of any variety, h30's, creambacks), these parameters almost always put me in the ballpark I want to be in. And I gathered this from doing the leg work, it sucks but you'll have to buckle down and dig in at some point. Personally I enjoyed it because it was like having access to every cab type I ever wanted in the analog realm right there in my room but you should definitely look for correlation between the IR's you're gravitating to rather than arbitrary names and positions is my advice
 
I mean: Let's say there's a tone you want to achieve, and you have 1,000 Cabs, a hundred of which will come close, but out of which there'll be one that's best.
"best" is a fleeting concept. there is always something better. our own definition of "better" changes from day to day as well. make a choice, and play.
 
for me it's easy. I know what cabs and speakers I like. I know what mics I like. I know what mic positions I like. I can 99 out of 100 times find what I'm looking for sticking to those things. no reason for me to try a cab and a speaker with a mic I know I never like in real life, it's just not a good use of my time. The only time I do it is if I'm really bored and just feel like seeing if something randomly grabs my ear.
 
When I first started working with IRs, what I did was listen to recordings that had guitar tones similar to what I wanted to achieve, and then try to google search the speaker/mic combinations that were used on the recording. Then I would search for IRs that had those respective combinations. This process helped a lot in the beginning!

It’s also a good idea to research what kinds of speakers were traditionally used with specific amps. Yek’s amp write ups are a great resource for that.
 
This gets even crazier because the IR's themselves influence so much of the texture and response you get, so it's not just about the EQ differences between cabs. That is to say, when I change cabs, I change settings at the amp to accentuate what I like. This makes it pretty ineffective to dial in a tone and just cycle through cab examples... well, shouldn't say ineffective because its a fine place to start, but it's certainly incomplete.

All I can say is I have maybe 10 IR's I like per goal. Squeaky cleans, pushed cleans, saturated classic power amp crunch, or fire breathing watt monsters, inside of those categories I have maybe 5-10 "go to" IR's. This is what I draw on when I need to spend my time learning/playing vs. exploring.

When I don't have a deadline, I go exploring. I dial an amp in for the mood I'm in, then I cycle cabs. When I find something special, I switch modes and cycle amps through that one cab to really "learn" it and what it brings to the table. I get a TON of practicing done across many genre's as I work through the cab list, lemme tell ya :D so I don't really mind that it's a pretty slow process
 
Yes, going through a bunch of IR's at random is not very productive. As mentioned above, you need to educate yourself on speaker types, and mic types, their characteristics, and speaker type that came with your amp model, or that maybe an Artist you like uses. This will narrow your choices down significantly. Then it's just a matter of auditioning 5-15 or so, and picking one that isn't too bright or too dark. Then you can start mixing if you want to step up your game b
 
Would be really cool (with all this new compute power), if when globally selected, and you add a new Amp, a related Cab Block would be chained and configured with these best IR version to match the Amp. This could save a lot of time (and frustration) with IR selection for just demoing amps.
 
Would be really cool (with all this new compute power), if when globally selected, and you add a new Amp, a related Cab Block would be chained and configured with these best IR version to match the Amp. This could save a lot of time (and frustration) with IR selection for just demoing amps.
who would determine the best IR that matches?
 
Would be really cool (with all this new compute power), if when globally selected, and you add a new Amp, a related Cab Block would be chained and configured with these best IR version to match the Amp. This could save a lot of time (and frustration) with IR selection for just demoing amps.
Not for me. I don't want my cab to change unless I tell it to change.
 
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