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[LVC]

You would need long cable runs to,from the fx loop on your amp right?
Does it have a buffer or something to compensate for the long cable runs you would need in and out of the FX loop?
Does it have midi for channel switching on your amp if you have it?
Will you be able to run a dry signal through the unit ? That way you get that direct signal going back into the amp too or does it have a mixer in it so you can mix the dry and fX together

You would need long cable runs to,from the fx loop on your amp right?

Length is need specific. I would recommend getting a custom snake -- folks like Lava sell them Lava Cable - Lava Tube Pedal Board Snake

Does it have a buffer or something to compensate for the long cable runs you would need in and out of the FX loop?

I have been building and use pedalboards for years -- the whole buffer at the end of the chain is a bunch of BS ands is not really even a consideration unless you are running extremely long cables on stage (30 plus feet).
One of the advantages of using a MF floorboard ( like the FX8 ) is that you are eliminating the additional patch wiring needed to connect pedals. A typical pedalboard might use 10 feet or significantly more depending on the complexity of the board. If between you board and amp cables you are running more than 30 - 40 feet, then a buffer might be advisable to return some of the highs to your signal.

The most important consideration IMO is the cable capacitance. You want to get as low cap cables as you can. for example, I personally like George L cables for my pedal patches. it is rated around 23pf per foot. Which means a lot more of the true signal is getting through. Same for guitar cables, I use Lava and that has a rating of about 25 pF/ft capacitance. Higher cap cables will darken your tone.

If you are using very high capacitance cables your tone is most likely very dark or even muddy (some folks dig that - so there is no right or wrong answer here) -- If you feel you are loosing some high end in your signal, I would first look at getting a lower cap cable before going down the buffer route.

Some folks prefer higher cap cables (especially if they have a bright amp) because the darken your tone-- personally I prefer low cap.

That being said -- your amp should ideally have a buffered effects loop (which is different)


Does it have midi for channel switching on your amp if you have it?

From what I understand, the FX8 has channel switching relays - regarding how it interfaces with will be amp specific (as with any board). For example my Carol Ann will need a converter that changes the changes the channel switching information from the amp to midi.

Will you be able to run a dry signal through the unit ? That way you get that direct signal going back into the amp too or does it have a mixer in it so you can mix the dry and fX together

The FX8 (as I understand it) is built for 4CM which means it is ready to interact with an amp that has a loop.What that means is that you will be able to route the effects of your choosing (i.e. time based effects) through the amp effects loop) and other effects of your choosing (drives/compressor, wah etc) through the input of the amp. Individual effects/drives will have a blend with dry signal). Again this is a typical setup with a traditional board.

 

[LVC]

So why exactly do we need another tube amp? To make things more fragile, heavy and less flexible? No thanks.

I love tube amps. IMO there is a significant difference tone and feel between tube and SS amps.

 

[LVC]

What are the RELAY OUTPUTS for?

I think they are to add your own pedals (i.e. overdrive) and control them through the FX8 (i.e. on/off in specific patches)

 

[yek]

Lava Cable - Lava Tube Pedal Board Snake[/URL]

Lava cable is never cheap but great quality. That snake seems like a nice solution. Maybe add a XLR cable to the snake, for people who will run an additional MFC Mk3/XL FASLINK connection (I have no doubt that there will be players combining their current MFC/Axe-Fx with a FX8).

 

[boardwlk17]

But I'm a relentless speculation addict. Now I have to armchair invent 6 new products all at once? Where will I find the time?

Edit: Four.. FX8 and the Fractal expression pedal were already photo-teased..

(re)edit:

1). Axe-Fx III
2). Bass-Fx
3). Studio Microphone Preamp Modeller
4). Amp modelling floorboard

5). FX-8R (rack mount)

 

[yek]

I think they are to add your own pedals (i.e. overdrive) and control them through the FX8 (i.e. on/off in specific patches)

Relay switching is the method used to control amp channel switching. Those 1/4" outputs connect physically to an amp to control its sounds, while their configuration is set inside the FX8. The G-Major and some other fx devices also offer relay switching.

Requires amps which support this of course. I used relay switching with my Bogner amps back in the time, using Bogner's Medusa cable.

MIDI-enabled amps do not need relay switching.

 

[LVC]

Lava cable is never cheap but great quality.

Been using Lava for years. Mark (owner) is a great cat to deal with and he has built a few custom snakes for me over the years.. His guitar cables are second to none in my book.

 

[LVC]

Relay switching is the method used to control amp channel switching. Those 1/4" outputs connect physically to an amp to control its sounds, while their configuration is set inside the FX8. The G-Major and some other fx devices also offer relay switching.

Requires amps which support this of course. I used relay switching with my Bogner amps back in the time, using Bogner's Medusa cable.

MIDI-enabled amps do not need relay switching.

yes (my bad) you control the amp channel through relays or midi-- the loops are for the pedals

 

[PBGas]

New around here!

Really interested in this product! I'm just hoping that it will be available without a 1 year waiting list type of thing that I have seen before.
Either way, hoping to sign up to order one soon!

Thx to the folks at Fractal for creating something that looks really fantastic! With those FX from the Axe units, it will sound absolutely stellar!

I didn't get to read through the entire thread yet but.....any idea what the dimensions of this unit are?

 

[Smilzo]

Please Cliff consider 4 istance of drive block. Distortion is never enough...
Seriously, 2 istance for tone forge before pre and a couple of drive to spice up tone of delay/modulation... yummy...

 

[Zwiebelchen]

I love tube amps. IMO there is a significant difference tone and feel between tube and SS amps.

Then IMHO the effort should go into designing a poweramp that feels like a tube amp but without the disadvantages of a tube amp. Progress does not come from making steps backwards.

 

[LVC]

Then IMHO the effort should go into designing a poweramp that feels like a tube amp but without the disadvantages of a tube amp. Progress does not come from making steps backwards.

Many threads on ss vs tube power amps.


I personally would be very interested in a head or combo amp (especially a combo) that combines a tube power section with selectable Fractal pre-amps.

Right now I am jazzed at the possibilities of using AF2 effects with my tube amps delivered in a format that is custom designed specifically for that application.

 

[Echophilia]

Can we assume there will be new factory presets in the FX8?

 

[mwc2112]

Please Cliff consider 4 istance of drive block. Distortion is never enough...

4 active at once or 4 available per patch? I would think with scenes you should be able to do the latter easily.

 

[echo44]

Have you tested the drool resistance
and comfort spacing of the switches?

 

[Highcastle_of_Tone]

The six are in addition to those you know about.

Now my eyes are going all crazy...

 

[Rocket Brother]

You would need long cable runs to,from the fx loop on your amp right?

Length is need specific. I would recommend getting a custom snake -- folks like Lava sell them Lava Cable - Lava Tube Pedal Board Snake

Does it have a buffer or something to compensate for the long cable runs you would need in and out of the FX loop?

I have been building and use pedalboards for years -- the whole buffer at the end of the chain is a bunch of BS ands is not really even a consideration unless you are running extremely long cables on stage (30 plus feet).
One of the advantages of using a MF floorboard ( like the FX8 ) is that you are eliminating the additional patch wiring needed to connect pedals. A typical pedalboard might use 10 feet or significantly more depending on the complexity of the board. If between you board and amp cables you are running more than 30 - 40 feet, then a buffer might be advisable to return some of the highs to your signal.

The most important consideration IMO is the cable capacitance. You want to get as low cap cables as you can. for example, I personally like George L cables for my pedal patches. it is rated around 23pf per foot. Which means a lot more of the true signal is getting through. Same for guitar cables, I use Lava and that has a rating of about 25 pF/ft capacitance. Higher cap cables will darken your tone.

If you are using very high capacitance cables your tone is most likely very dark or even muddy (some folks dig that - so there is no right or wrong answer here) -- If you feel you are loosing some high end in your signal, I would first look at getting a lower cap cable before going down the buffer route.

Some folks prefer higher cap cables (especially if they have a bright amp) because the darken your tone-- personally I prefer low cap.

That being said -- your amp should ideally have a buffered effects loop (which is different)


Does it have midi for channel switching on your amp if you have it?

From what I understand, the FX8 has channel switching relays - regarding how it interfaces with will be amp specific (as with any board). For example my Carol Ann will need a converter that changes the changes the channel switching information from the amp to midi.

Will you be able to run a dry signal through the unit ? That way you get that direct signal going back into the amp too or does it have a mixer in it so you can mix the dry and fX together

The FX8 (as I understand it) is built for 4CM which means it is ready to interact with an amp that has a loop.What that means is that you will be able to route the effects of your choosing (i.e. time based effects) through the amp effects loop) and other effects of your choosing (drives/compressor, wah etc) through the input of the amp. Individual effects/drives will have a blend with dry signal). Again this is a typical setup with a traditional board.

I disagree about the use or need for buffers being BS, mostly when people say that it's because

1) they are really lucky to have a board with no significant loading and impedance problems (usually a small purist board)
2) they have only put a buffer at the end of the signal chain and not one in the front as well (I know I know some ways and fuzzes don't like pst buffers)
3) they have used poorly designed (tonally coloured) buffers (doesn't mean they can't be expensive and hyped by "internet experts")
4) they have tin ears

Most people - even with just a few pedals on their board - would notice a difference to the better if they tried a Skrydstrup or Vertex dual buffer with their board.
Whether you need that difference is naturally another matter, but IMHO the topic is very far away for being BS.
With the FX8 though I don't think a buffer will be needed as I never felt the need to put a buffer in front of my Axe Fx II (maybe Cliff has build in an input buffer in the FX8 ?)

I agree that the cables are very important, but I'm not too fond of George L's - I used them for a long time and the are low capacitance, but sound a bit cold to me.

yes (my bad) you control the amp channel through relays or midi-- the loops are for the pedals

Loops ?
Unless I missed something (which is absolutely possible) Cliff didn't announce loops on the FX8, only th efx loop needed to make 4CM work.

 

[LVC]

I disagree about the use or need for buffers being BS, mostly when people say that it's because

1) they are really lucky to have a board with no significant loading and impedance problems (usually a small purist board)
2) they have only put a buffer at the end of the signal chain and not one in the front as well (I know I know some ways and fuzzes don't like pst buffers)
3) they have used poorly designed (tonally coloured) buffers (doesn't mean they can't be expensive and hyped by "internet experts")
4) they have tin ears

Most people - even with just a few pedals on their board - would notice a difference to the better if they tried a Skrydstrup or Vertex dual buffer with their board.
Whether you need that difference is naturally another matter, but IMHO the topic is very far away for being BS.
With the FX8 though I don't think a buffer will be needed as I never felt the need to put a buffer in front of my Axe Fx II (maybe Cliff has build in an input buffer in the FX8 ?)

I agree that the cables are very important, but I'm not too fond of George L's - I used them for a long time and the are low capacitance, but sound a bit cold to me.

Loops ?
Unless I missed something (which is absolutely possible) Cliff didn't announce loops on the FX8, only th efx loop needed to make 4CM work.

I stated in my post that unless you are running a lot of cable (off board to amp and on the board) you don't need a buffer -- . If you are losing high end it is mostly due to high cap cables.

If you look at the Vertex boards -- Mason uses a ton of cabling. I would be willing to bet he uses an average 20 feet plus per board. So the rule of thumb is 2x.

So if you look at his typical board and you are running another 20 feet to the amp -- you are looking at about 60 feet of cables. In this case you most certainly will benefit from a buffer. Also he uses (or use to use ) Magami cables which IMO are fairly high capacitance ( over 40pF/Ft) which 2x Lava or George L. which is also another reason why you will need a buffer.

For the average board with 6-10 pedals and if you have cable left over from a George L patch kit -- there is no need for buffer. Again, unless you have a specific application in mind (i.e. wah/fuzz), use line only devices, pedals that like buffers or are using ridiculously long or high pF cables -- adding a buffer is a waste of money.

Regarding loops for pedals -- I might be mistaken - but I thought the FX8 had them. It would be nice but not a big deal.

 

[Robboman]

Does anyone else find it interesting they're even doing a product specifically meant for guys who don't use amp modelling? I mean, from a brand positioning POV?

Maybe it's just me, but I've always mentally equated Fractal to Amp Modelling. The FX are great, but the REAL story has always been the Amp block. The first legit, no-compromise digital box that can 'really' replace tube amps, even for top pros, producers and the most demanding amp-tone cork-sniffers of the world. It seems like Fractal has been on a mission to win over the anti-digital tube superiority mindset from day one, and they have succeeded - big time. It's even being called 'historic'.

Now they turn around and release the FX8, a product that says " Hey, we know that amp modelling is still not good enough for a lot of you, so here's an FX-only product we hope you'll like."

I know this unit has it's place and will sell tons, but I find it interesting. Just discussion fodder really. Maybe I shoulda been a marketing guy...

 

[nicolasrivera]

Now they turn around and release the FX8, a product that says " Hey, we know that amp modelling is still not good enough for a lot of you, so here's an FX-only product we hope you'll like."

That is stretching it a bit too far......